Curse

Ruhern · May 02, 2006, 07:40 PM // 19:40

Okay so what do you think of this build, please let me know what you think and tell me any flaws you see (meaning things that this build will have a tough time with).

Warrior/Monk

Armor:
All Sentinel's with Knight's Boots or Gloves (depending on your visual preference)

Weapon (primary):
Axe or Sword
3/-1 vampiric mod
+1 Axe/Sword (20% chance)
15% more damage while enchanted

Weapon (secondary):
Axe or Sword, no Vampiric Mod, but anything else you want

Shields:
Strength shield with +45 health -2 received damage while enchanted
Strength shield with +60 health -3 received damage while hexed
Or whatever else you want

Runes:
Superior Axe/Sword
Superior Absorption
Superior Strength
Superior Vigor

Attributes:
Strength 9+1+3 = 13
Axe/Sword 11+3 = 14
Healing 8
Smiting 8

Skills:
Battle Rage (Strength)
Standing Slash (Swordsmanship, Factions)
Sun and Moon Slash (Swordsmanship, Factions)
Galrath Slash (Swordsmanship)
Factions Galrath Slash equivalent (forgot the name)
Mending (Healing, +3 health regen)
Strength of Honor (Smiting, +6 damage)
Ressurection Sigent

The idea of the build is pretty straight forward. Cast Mending, Cast Strength of Honor, get Battle Rage going and go nuts with the adrenaline skills. You've got 13% armor penetration from you Strength being at 13, constant healing from Mending + Vampiric. 9 extra damage from Strength of Honor and Vampiric. And you've got 100 armor. Sure you get dinged VS degen, but what warrior build doesn't?

Then there is the Axe version where you use 4 axe adrenaline skills. I haven't done it yet but plan to as soon as I can. With Factions, there are now two versions of Penetrating blow, which means 33% armor penetration. I'd use those two, Dismember for the Deep Wound, and Executioner's Strike for the good Damage. I think the Axe version will work out better due to the Deep Wound skill. I doin't like using Sever/Gash with sword because it limits the damage "spike" from having 4 good damaging skills down to two (once you cause bleeding and deep wound those two skills become useless against the same target).

I also tried incorporating Sigent of Strength (at 13 Strength: Your Next 14 attacks do +5 damage) for a total of +14 damage per attack but it caused problems with Battle Rage.

Let me know what you think, thanks!

Excal · May 02, 2006, 09:45 PM // 21:45

Do not bring mending in pvp, ever.

JR · May 02, 2006, 10:01 PM // 22:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Excal

Do not bring mending in pvp, ever.

QFT.

And if you are going to put strength up to 13, for the love of god at least use some decent strength skills to justify it. Bull's Strike, Endure Pain... etc. Battle Rage is fairly bad.

Ruhern · May 02, 2006, 11:12 PM // 23:12

Excal:
Please expand. Why not bring Mending into PvP? I never quite understood this one.

Of course I play mostly RA, but my question still stands.

JR-:
If I have -2 energy regen from enchantments I can't bring in skills that require energy.

And what's wrong with Battle Rage? Move 25% faster, it's like a constant Sprint, plus gain adrenaline faster: you can use those adrenaline skills twice as many times. It just takes 4 hits to start the madness.

Katari · May 03, 2006, 02:15 AM // 02:15

Mending is a bad heal on a character that doesn't need to devote atribute points to healing anyway. It is a waste of energy, atribute points, and the skill slot that it ocupies. A warrior should be able to get away with healing sig as a heal in PvP, if that.

You have no Deep Wound, why? It looks like you're confusing DPS with spiking.

Personaly I don't why you'd use Sentinal's armor anyway. If you insist on using Battle Rage, you could use Legionare's and then not be 'forced' into using a +str helm, which is good because +str helms suck.

16 Sword
? Str
? Tactics

Sever
Gash
Final Thrust
*something*
Bull's Charge
Frenzy
Healing Signet
Res Sig

That should work better if you plan on killing targets in PvP.

Gigamaster89 · May 03, 2006, 02:17 AM // 02:17

Mending's healing pips is so small it really doesn't make a difference unless your running away. With all the health degen and spikes, 3 or so more regen is...not too great.

I use Battles Rage sometimes for farming but that fact that when it ends, you lose all adrenaline and you can't use any non-attack spell while it's on isn't too beneficial.

Anyway, the name of the skill your thinking of is Silverwing Slash.

wangburger · May 03, 2006, 11:40 AM // 11:40

I usually do a build quite similar to thisin RA except I use an axe. Legionaries (sp?) armor is your best bet because you should always be in a stance with battle rage on.

Falcon213 · May 03, 2006, 11:57 AM // 11:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruhern

With Factions, there are now two versions of Penetrating blow, which means 33% armor penetration.

Armor penetration from PB and Strength don't stack. It's 20% flat.

I can't think of any time in pvp where you would ever want more than 9 strength. 9 means you can use victo's/tanzit's and have 12 sec sprint/15 sec rush. Armor penetration doesn't do enough to warrant any more points.

glountz · May 03, 2006, 12:32 PM // 12:32

Use this build with the following equipment to have fun in RA with sentinel armor.
Warrior/Necro

Equipment
Sentinel Armor except for boots: Use Knight boots.
Zealous axe of defense (+1 energy on hit/-1 energy regen, +5 armor, +15% damage when in stance)
Shield (AL 16, +45Hp, -2 Damage reduction when in stance)
Sup absorption rune.
Sup vigor rune.

Attributes
12+3 Axe
9+1+3 Strenght
9+1 Tactics

Skills
Rez signet
Plague touch
Healing signet
Frenzy
Rush
"Watch Yourself"
Power Attack
Eviscerate [E]

Warrior basics apply:
Use frenzy only to spike or against static opponents. Don't use healing signet under frenzy. Renew Watch yourself only when needed or to protect a nearby teammate. Trigger the Deep Wound of Eviscerate with Power attack, which you should spam. Be in Rush state always to meet your equipment requirements.
Use plague touch only to get rid of problematic conditions (Blind/Cripple). Fight degen with Healing signet.

Have fun with your 141 armor/-7Damage reduction.
A max fireball shouldn't deal to you more than 30 damage.

Nightwish · May 03, 2006, 01:39 PM // 13:39

Giving up hp (sup rune) for higher armor worth it?

glountz · May 03, 2006, 01:53 PM // 13:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightwish

Giving up hp (sup rune) for higher armor worth it?

Yes.
In the build I gave, you have still 101 armor/-7 when casting Healing signet. The +45Hp from the shield helps too (you have 425 HP when in stance, not so bad).
Big deal with Sentinel armor is too laugh at elementalists' faces.
However in real PvP you don't need this armor, just to focus on damage.

In PVE, Sentinel armor is the ultimate farming armor, IMO.

Ruhern · May 03, 2006, 11:40 PM // 23:40

Okay, so the main point is damage right...

The way I see it, my build still does more damage than the builds presented to me. With Battle Rage, adrenaline gain is increased, making my 4 adrenaline damage skills more spammable, not to mention I'm running 25% faster all the time.

holden · May 04, 2006, 12:05 AM // 00:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruhern

Okay, so the main point is damage right...

The way I see it, my build still does more damage than the builds presented to me. With Battle Rage, adrenaline gain is increased, making my 4 adrenaline damage skills more spammable, not to mention I'm running 25% faster all the time.

your build won't do more damage than glountz's.

mending is a selfish skill for pvp. drop if for something that will help the team and trust that your monk will heal you.
if you want to hang out in random arena and don't care about team play then just drop it for a skill that's good. the heal you get from it isn't worth the energy lost.

battlerage isn't a bad skill. but if you have to give up your elite spot you want more than what it gives. for example, eviscerate is fantastic because it's adrenal and does crazy damage that often will finish your target. battlerage is a speed buff but sprint works great at low strength. gaining double adrenaline is also nice but if you don't have eviscerate to use with all that adrenaline it's like pizza without cheese.

you have 8 in smite just for +6 damage. put that towards your weapon and get it to 16.

i think the armor is cool too but if you're gonna put an attribute that high you need to work your build around it. if you drop the inefficient mending you'll have the energy to use strength based skills.

Excal · May 04, 2006, 03:54 PM // 15:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruhern

Excal:
Please expand. Why not bring Mending into PvP? I never quite understood this one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katari

Mending is a bad heal on a character that doesn't need to devote atribute points to healing anyway. It is a waste of energy, atribute points, and the skill slot that it ocupies.

Quote:

Originally Posted by holden

mending is a selfish skill for pvp. drop if for something that will help the team and trust that your monk will heal you.
if you want to hang out in random arena and don't care about team play then just drop it for a skill that's good. the heal you get from it isn't worth the energy lost.

Ty for saving me from typing this

Ruhern · May 04, 2006, 04:30 PM // 16:30

Like I said, I play mostly RA. If I played TA or anything else where I knew there'd be monks it'd be a different story I suppose. However, I did drop the attribute points from healing and put them into Tactics using Healing Signet (however using this skill ends Battle Rage, hindering the whole idea of the build very much). I even messed around with no Smiting, maxed out Swords and put the rest into Tactics using 5 different attack skills.

I must say though, that glountz's build does NOT do more damage than my build. Power Attack, Eviscerate, and Frenzy do not meet the damage output of 4 or 5 attack skills with Battle Rage. If you don't believe me, try it out for yourself.

And one thing I was wondering, if I'm supposed to depend on the monk and not bring my own monk heal skills, why would I bring healing sig? Double standards, all of you! Shame! If Mending is not enough, I'll bring Mending and Live Vicariously.

Katari · May 04, 2006, 05:23 PM // 17:23

Well, I don't have any idea why glontz put power attack on that build...

Attributes
12+1+3 Axe
6+1 Strenght
11+1 Tactics

Skills
Rez signet
Plague touch
Healing signet
Frenzy
Sprint
"Watch Yourself"
Exe Strike
Eviscerate [E]

That's a bit better, you should swap out 'WY!" for another attack skill if you plan to use this build outside of RA. Altough I am honestly not a fan of playing warriors in RA as it is.

Edit, eh, I don't even use "WY!" in RA for that matter...

glountz · May 04, 2006, 05:48 PM // 17:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Katari

Well, I don't have any idea why glontz put power attack on that build...

Because Exec costs 7 AD. Spamming Rush and WY seriously alter your AD gain. Power attack does +27 damage (thanks to your high strenght) every 4 seconds.
Because of the "AD sucking" by rush and watch yourself, you will spam Exec a lot less often.
Try both, you'll see.
Evisc is too powerful to get rid of it.

However, by looking your build, I must say that 13 Strenght is a prerequisite to wear the sentinel armor - with a helmet +1 strenght and not +1 Weapon (so you have to build a gimmick build around that value). You have only 7. Hmm, maybe you missed the point of this thread?
Whatever.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruhern

I must say though, that glountz's build does NOT do more damage than my build. Power Attack, Eviscerate, and Frenzy do not meet the damage output of 4 or 5 attack skills with Battle Rage. If you don't believe me, try it out for yourself.

I must admit I agree completely with you. Your build has more DPS, no matter what I can say.
But it is completely unflexible. You have nothing to get rid of all those nasty conds you'll get in RA/TA. You have no efficient self healing, no monk mean your death. You have no Deep wound plus IAS to spike, so your sipke capabilities a pretty much limited even if your overall DPS are greater.
I you wanted to focus on damage, my point is: don't use sentinel armor! The only reason to use it is for the defense it provides (so I build a rather defensive build who still could kill effectively).
Boost your weapon mastery to 16 (14 is too low), wear Dragons and Battle Rage if you want.
But Battle rage stuck you with attack skills, meaning no flexibility.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruhern

And one thing I was wondering, if I'm supposed to depend on the monk and not bring my own monk heal skills, why would I bring healing sig? Double standards, all of you! Shame! If Mending is not enough, I'll bring Mending and Live Vicariously.

Healing signet is energy free and can fight heavy damage load if you know how to play. Your mending can't fight the damage you'll take if you're targeted.

Excal · May 04, 2006, 05:50 PM // 17:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruhern

Like I said, I play mostly RA. If I played TA or anything else where I knew there'd be monks it'd be a different story I suppose. However, I did drop the attribute points from healing and put them into Tactics using Healing Signet (however using this skill ends Battle Rage, hindering the whole idea of the build very much). I even messed around with no Smiting, maxed out Swords and put the rest into Tactics using 5 different attack skills.

I must say though, that glountz's build does NOT do more damage than my build. Power Attack, Eviscerate, and Frenzy do not meet the damage output of 4 or 5 attack skills with Battle Rage. If you don't believe me, try it out for yourself.

And one thing I was wondering, if I'm supposed to depend on the monk and not bring my own monk heal skills, why would I bring healing sig? Double standards, all of you! Shame! If Mending is not enough, I'll bring Mending and Live Vicariously.

Healing Signet is a good self heal if used correctly, mending is not.

Frenzy is a sufficent adrenaline gainer and it adds extra pressure to the enemy, ditch Battle Rage and take the new sword elite Dragon Slash or even quivering blade which is nice and spammable provided it doesnt get blocked, and try to fit in Contemplation Of Purity its a decent self heal which has the potential to remove all your hexes and conditions and give you a 3/4 second heal provided you have enough enchantments on you, which could be useful in GvG/HA

Ruhern · May 04, 2006, 09:49 PM // 21:49

Good points. I guess this is more of a gimmick build for RA. It works pretty well there for the most part. It's difficult to balance warrior defenses (removal of hexes/conditions) while still maintaining good offense. Bring too many defenses and you are near worthless in the offense. Bring only a little defense and it's never enough. Maybe I'll just have to start bringing Purge Signet along with me.

Though Contemplation of Purity won't work very well as a heal, since it's a Divine Favor skill (Monk Primary attribute).

Beat_Go_Stick · May 04, 2006, 10:40 PM // 22:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by glountz

Use this build with the following equipment to have fun in RA with sentinel armor.
Warrior/Necro

Equipment
Sentinel Armor except for boots: Use Knight boots.
Zealous axe of defense (+1 energy on hit/-1 energy regen, +5 armor, +15% damage when in stance)
Shield (AL 16, +45Hp, -2 Damage reduction when in stance)
Sup absorption rune.
Sup vigor rune.

Attributes
12+3 Axe
9+1+3 Strenght
9+1 Tactics

Skills
Rez signet
Plague touch
Healing signet
Frenzy
Rush
"Watch Yourself"
Power Attack
Eviscerate [E]

Imo, the extra point of Tactics really isn't worth it. I would go:
12+1+3 Axe
10+3 Strength
8+1 Tactics

Healing Signet still heals for 110, I think, "WY!" still lasts plenty long enough when you need it, and the extra point of Axe will do some good

Otherwise I would change nothing

Heh, I really need to pick up a 15k set of this stuff for my W/Mo